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10 Best Spinners of All time

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kirankri View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote kirankri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: 10 Best Spinners of All time
    Posted: 18 May 2010 at 2:02pm
We already have a thread for top 10 fast bowlers of all time. In fact, while selecting the top 10 fast bowlers, the problem was whom to leave out. I was thinking about the top 10 spinners of all time. When we consider not just the players whom, we have seen (at least I have seen), we could get a list of great spinners. But when I started thinking about the bowlers, I have seen, it was very difficult to get 10 great spinner. So I have made two lists. One - the list which contains not only spinners I have seen, but those about whom I have read. Here are the lists:

All time top 10 (not in any order):
Jim Laker
Derek Underwood
Erapalli Prasanna
Bishen Bedi
Subhash Gupte
Abdul Quadir
Shane Warne
Ritchie Benaud
Lance Gibbs
Bill O'Reilly

Top 10 I have seen (There are some bowlers who couldn't be termed as great. But we haven't got many great spinners in the last 20 years or so)
Shane Warne
Anil Kumble
Abdul Qadir
Saqlain Mustaq
Iqbal Qasim
Dilip Doshi
Daniel Vettori
Derek Underwood
Stuart McGill
Venkatapathy Raju
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milkman View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote milkman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 May 2010 at 2:53pm
No MURALI
Ideal cricketer: Bowl like Warne, bat like Tendulkar, field like Jonty!!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote dips_december Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 May 2010 at 3:40pm
Top 10 that I have seen are :
Shane Warne
Muttiah Muralidharan
Anil Kumble
Stuart MacGill
Saqlain Mushtaq
Mushtaq Ahmed
Daniel Vettori
Graeme Swann
Harbhajan Singh

Couldn't find a tenth one!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote milkman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 May 2010 at 4:05pm
Top 6 I have seen in the past 10 years and can fully rate:

Warne
Kumble
Saqlain
Mushtaq Ahmed
Stuart MacGill
Daniel Vettori

No one else warrants a spot. I believe Swann will be one of the standout spinners in the next few years, won't put him on my list just yet until he's played a lot more cricket. I don't include Harbhajan and Mural.


Edited by milkman - 18 May 2010 at 4:09pm
Ideal cricketer: Bowl like Warne, bat like Tendulkar, field like Jonty!!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote kahmad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 May 2010 at 8:10am
Top 10 that I have seen are :

Shane Warne
Muttiah Muralidharan
Anil Kumble
Abdul Qadir
Saqlain Mushtaq
Mushtaq Ahmed
Daniel Vettori
Graeme Swann
Harbhajan Singh
Danish Kaneria
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Post Options Post Options   Quote milkman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 May 2010 at 12:48pm
Looks like Pakistan have produced some quality spinners in the last 25 years, namely Qadir, Kaneria, Mushtaq and Saqlain.
My overall list from what I know would include the likes of Grimmet, O'Reilly, Laker, Warne, Prasanna, Bedi, Kumble, Gibbs, Saqlain, Underwood, Benaud, Qadir, Venkat, MacGill.
Ideal cricketer: Bowl like Warne, bat like Tendulkar, field like Jonty!!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote kirankri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 May 2010 at 12:56pm
Nice list with one exception Milky. From what I have heard, Venkat was not that great a bowler. Prasanna regarded as the best offspinner they have ever played by many top batsman of that era was always the first choice. Venkat sometimes got the chance few times due to his better fielding and batting abilities compared to Prasanna. On the other hand Chandra would be a better choice. But if we are allowed to select only top 10, even Chandra wouldn't make it to the list as Subash Gupte is the best legspinner, India has ever produced. And according to Gary Sobers, the best leg spinner he has ever played/seen Warne inclusive.

But I haven't seen any of these bowlers in action unfortunately. Not sure even Sledge or Clobbs have seen them in action.


Edited by kirankri - 19 May 2010 at 12:57pm
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Post Options Post Options   Quote milkman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 May 2010 at 1:24pm
Warne is diffferent. I mean statistically he's not the best, but there was a buzz about him, an aura I guess. He lifted the side in a way other bowlers couldn't and really put fear in the batsmen. At the start of career he was doing things with the ball that no one else in history was doing and by the end of his career he simplified his style much more and in actuality it worked. Bowling conditions changed. In the 90s only 3 batsmen averaged 50 (Lara, Waugh, Tendulkar), with the next best average 43 (Mark Waugh), then in the 00s maybe 20 or more averaged over 48. So he had to change, and he adapted so well. That's why Warne is considered so highly. 
Ideal cricketer: Bowl like Warne, bat like Tendulkar, field like Jonty!!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote bladescape Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2010 at 1:38pm
Originally posted by milkman

At the start of career he was doing things with the ball that no one else in history was doing and by the end of his career he simplified his style much more and in actuality it worked.


Let me see,1/140-something or was it 150-something on debut?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote milkman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2010 at 1:49pm
I would say after he took that 7-for against the W.I. is where he really started his career.
Ideal cricketer: Bowl like Warne, bat like Tendulkar, field like Jonty!!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote sam_ahmed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2010 at 7:40pm

The top 10 I have seen

Shane Warne
Muttiah Muralidaran
Anil Kumble
Saqlain Mushtaq
Daniel Vettori
Harbhajan Singh
Stuart MacGill
Mushtaq Ahmed
Ray Price
Danish Kaneria
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Post Options Post Options   Quote zuhair_abbasi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 May 2010 at 8:08am
I really wont include Murali and Harbhajan for obvious reasons. Among those I have seen

Warne
Saqlaiin
Kumble
Qadir
Tufnell
Vettori
Mushy
McGill
Kaneria
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Post Options Post Options   Quote milkman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 May 2010 at 10:38am
I agree with your list Zuhair, top quality tweakers in that bunch. Your order looks about right too, although I rate MacGill , Mushy and Vettori above Tuffers.
Ideal cricketer: Bowl like Warne, bat like Tendulkar, field like Jonty!!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote zuhair_abbasi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 May 2010 at 1:09pm
I like Vettori but Tufnell on his day was really beautiful to watch.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote bladescape Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 July 2010 at 10:59am
Originally posted by milkman

I would say after he took that 7-for against the W.I. is where he really started his career.


That's not what the records say!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote MalhotraRaj84 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 July 2010 at 11:06am
Warne,Murali and Kumble are the top three spinners that I have seen.

Rest do not even come close to bother my thought processes a bit.


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Post Options Post Options   Quote bladescape Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 July 2010 at 11:24am
Originally posted by MalhotraRaj84

Warne,Murali and Kumble are the top three spinners that I have seen.Rest do not even come close to bother my thought processes a bit.


I think there were a few.....
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zuhair_abbasi View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote zuhair_abbasi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 July 2010 at 1:03pm
He probably never saw the Mushtaq's bowl
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Post Options Post Options   Quote MalhotraRaj84 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 July 2010 at 3:03pm
I have seen Saqlain bowl , but yes I have not seen all his 208 wickets in tests.

Still I would go with Warne,Murali and Kumble as the best spinner that I have seen , who stood the test of time and took such bulk of wickets passing 500 mark.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote spin wizard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 July 2010 at 1:37pm
I'm with Raj, those 3 are my standouts, probably would even end up in a top 5 all time of spinners.  Saqlain was a very fine bowler too, one things fo certain, i've managed to see the era of top class spinners, unlike missing the ones with great fast bowlers.
 
Warne, Murali, Kumble, Saqlain, Mushtaq, Vettori, Harbhajan, Swann, Kaneria.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote milkman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 July 2010 at 4:09pm
Warne and Saqlain are the only 2 that truly stand out for me to be honest. I won't put Murali down as a spin bowler, my opinion only.
Mushtaq, Qadir, MacGill were brilliant leggies, but didn't add anything to the game.
Kumble was effective rather than great. In fact, most bowlers pre WWII bowled in his mould, except the pitches were uncovered thus giving them more assistance. So of course I do rate Kumble highly, but not in the same light as Warne.
Vettori, Swann and so forth are excellent finger spinners, but still nothing out of the blue.

Saqlain revolutionised off break bowling and that's what Warne also did for spin bowling in general, particularly leg break bowling.

Murali is a javelin thrower.
Ideal cricketer: Bowl like Warne, bat like Tendulkar, field like Jonty!!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote zuhair_abbasi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 July 2010 at 8:18am
Agreed on most of what you said Milkly. But I do think Mushy's googly was better than any leggie's I have ever seen. I have seen enough of qadir - but Mushy's googly stands out for me.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote milkman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 July 2010 at 3:01pm
Mushy and Qadir both had wonderful googlies, particularly Mushy. He also had a handy flipper and was a really decent option for Pakistan. Both he and Saqqi were treated pretty ordinarily. Pakistan began to favour guys like Shahid and Shoaib Malik to do the spin options and then Danish Kaneria and forgot that they had 2 close to great spinners of different styles , who were still young enough at their disposal. Wasted talent. Raj in another thread claims Saqqi is not good enough because he only got 200 wickets. He was dropped, realistically, because of political agenda, not because of ability. Wasim, Waqar, Mushtaq, Saqlain and Razzaq was one of the best attacks I've ever seen. Don't know how often that combination was used though.
Ideal cricketer: Bowl like Warne, bat like Tendulkar, field like Jonty!!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote spin wizard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 July 2010 at 8:08pm
Seems like the Pakistanis have a knock of having excellent googlies.  Kaneria has a very good one too.
 
And how could I have forgotten MacGill in that list, a spinner I really enjoyed watching, spun the ball a mile!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote crapbag Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 August 2010 at 12:36pm
Top 10 all time

1. Murali
2. Barnes
3. O'Riely
4. Grimmet
5. Warne
6. Kumble
7. Qadir
8. Chandrashekar
9. Laker
10. Gibbs

(Unlucky ones, Rhodes, MacGill, Bedi, Harbhajan, Gupte)

The ones I have seen
1. Murali
2. Warne
3. Kumble
4. Qadir
5. Saqlain
6. Mushtaq
7. Harbhajan
8. MacGill
9. Warnaweera
10. Shakib

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Post Options Post Options   Quote crapbag Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 August 2010 at 12:37pm
Originally posted by milkman

Top 6 I have seen in the past 10 years and can fully rate:

Warne
Kumble
Saqlain
Mushtaq Ahmed
Stuart MacGill
Daniel Vettori

No one else warrants a spot. I believe Swann will be one of the standout spinners in the next few years, won't put him on my list just yet until he's played a lot more cricket. I don't include Harbhajan and Mural.
If you are that picky don't mention Warne as well.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote milkman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 August 2010 at 12:43pm
When Warne took a non performance enhancing diuretic he was suspended for 1 year. Why did Murali face no ban for contravening bowling laws? He's a chucker, simple as that. 
Ideal cricketer: Bowl like Warne, bat like Tendulkar, field like Jonty!!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote crapbag Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 August 2010 at 12:50pm
Originally posted by milkman

When Warne took a non performance enhancing diuretic he was suspended for 1 year. Why did Murali face no ban for contravening bowling laws? He's a chucker, simple as that. 
Warne took a masking agent to mask something that he could get in to trouble and lied that it was given to him by his mum for weight reduction. I am not going to talk about match fixing allegations.

In the case of Murali, the laws was changed to suit everybody, because it was proved that only Sarwan can be regarded as legal according to the older laws. And guess what, Pollock and McGrath both were found to be extending it up to 12 degreed, far more than 7.5 which they were allowed. As a blanket statement, they choose 15, otherwise some deliveries from McGrath has to no balled as well.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote spin wizard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 August 2010 at 1:36pm
Crapbag, watching 1000 frames per second replay shows us that many a bowlers don't extend their elbows at all and that's fine enough for me.  Not saying Murali chucks but this think with everyone extends their elbow is total nonsense to me.  Once saw a replay of Edwards on extra slow mo, his elbow didn't even straighten to any noticeable degree.  Probably those tests picks up what happens on the inside, that's all I can say.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote crapbag Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 August 2010 at 8:50am
Originally posted by spin wizard

Crapbag, watching 1000 frames per second replay shows us that many a bowlers don't extend their elbows at all and that's fine enough for me.  Not saying Murali chucks but this think with everyone extends their elbow is total nonsense to me.  Once saw a replay of Edwards on extra slow mo, his elbow didn't even straighten to any noticeable degree.  Probably those tests picks up what happens on the inside, that's all I can say.
It may be non sense to you, but it had made perfect sense for the people who know about bowling like Michael Holding who were in the panel. Everybody chucks  except Sarwan under the old law. May be difficult to swallow first, but that is a fact. That is the very reason the law was changed to what it is.
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