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BackwardPoint
Square Leg
Joined: 02 November 2011
Posts: 307
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Topic: Australia vs. India (in Australia) Posted: 26 January 2012 at 2:10pm |
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spin - Sharma is more talented than Kohli but Kohli's aggression and temperament gives him the edge. In terms of pure ability, Sharma still wins for me.
Sledge - The thing is the commentators have to keep the viewer interested as well. If they just keep saying "wow, this is stunningly bad cricket, what a no contest, you might as well turn off the telly because we all know the result" then its not going to be particularly engrossing so yeah, they are just looking for some positives and when there are none to be found, they are just making them up lol.
Channel 9 is really bad though, everything is so cheesy with the meaningless trivia questions, endlessly repeated KFC classic catches, pointless tweets from random people and not to forget, viewer questions with absolutely no relevance like who is the most exciting batsman in world cricket, which obviously Warner will win seeing as it is an Australian poll. Plus, anytime Nicholas, Healy or Slats are in the box, I mostly have it on mute. I'll never complain about Sky's presentation/commentary again.
We don't get to see the tea breaks/cricket shows at lunch times etc. Mikey but that surprises me from Ganguly. What does he expect? Does he think the other pundits are going to be praising the Indians for a majestic tour and some star performances? They have just lost 7 consecutive away Tests and about to lose their 8th, not just losing but getting hammered. Anyone trying to deflect criticism needs to take a good hard look at the state of Indian cricket for where it really is, not where they would like it be or where it can potentially be.
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sam_ahmed
Middle-Order Batsman
Joined: 27 November 2007
Location: India
Posts: 4363
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Posted: 26 January 2012 at 4:55pm |
very good century by Kohli, this man plays with a lot of determination as spinny has already said and that is something which impresses me, and in fact everyone of us. It's also an indication that old players need to go, just look at Kohli, he was about to be dropped for Sharma but the faith in him and persistence with him paid off, same goes for other youger players, India will be much better off if the transition phase starts at least from the next series which means this could be the last innings VVS Laxman will play.
Aussies bowled well, even when Kohli and Saha were doing well they didn't lose their cool and came back brilliantly, Siddle was excellent, Hilfy and harris also bowled well and I thought Lyon did a fair job within his limitations, a lead of around 520-540 will be good, they can play till 1 hour after lunch tomorrow.
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God is a better planner... so whenever u'r plan fails, cheer up... God has a better plan for you!
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Mikey
First Slip
Joined: 28 March 2011
Location: Australia
Posts: 949
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Posted: 27 January 2012 at 1:55am |
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Dharamsena has to be one of the worst umpires in the test arena at the moment. 3 bad decisions in this Australia innings, Clarke, Hussey and Marsh - quite pathetic, let's be honest. In fact, the umpiring in this whole match has been atrocious, Ashwin and Kohli both got poor decisions too (although I think Dar was the umpire - and without DRS he doesn't look anywhere near as confident).
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Sledger
Captain
Dickenson can marry my mother-in-law !
Joined: 08 August 2005
Location: South Africa
Posts: 15694
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Posted: 27 January 2012 at 5:26am |
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I agree Mikey , Dharamsena is clueless and has probably given the final shove that will see Marsh out of the side. I've said it before - the ICC have to make DRS part and parcel of every international match - they need to show some teeth!
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Mental disintegration works for me !!
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Sledger
Captain
Dickenson can marry my mother-in-law !
Joined: 08 August 2005
Location: South Africa
Posts: 15694
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Posted: 27 January 2012 at 5:31am |
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India on the ropes as Tendulkar falls tamely to the spinner Lyon 100-4 and no way back from here , 4-0 it is.
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Mental disintegration works for me !!
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spin wizard
Opening Bowler
The worlds next great spinner
Joined: 21 January 2006
Location: Saint Vincent
Posts: 9453
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Posted: 27 January 2012 at 12:51pm |
I wonder which is more disgraceful, this series lost or the one to England? I'd say this one. Even on such great batting decks as the adelaide oval, they can't even make 300 runs! or maybe it's how I saw more of this tour than the England one.....
The aussies are bowling really well but I found in England, the bowlers always had the ball doing something. On this Adelaide deck, the movement was not extravagant. I'd have prefer to be seeing West Indies play than this Indian outfit, and that says a lot!
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In troubled times, being philosophical helps a great deal, it helps you to remain sane and not do any further damage.
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sam_ahmed
Middle-Order Batsman
Joined: 27 November 2007
Location: India
Posts: 4363
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Posted: 27 January 2012 at 4:01pm |
Originally posted by Mikey
Dharamsena has to be one of the worst umpires in the test arena at the moment. 3 bad decisions in this Australia innings, Clarke, Hussey and Marsh - quite pathetic, let's be honest. In fact, the umpiring in this whole match has been atrocious, Ashwin and Kohli both got poor decisions too (although I think Dar was the umpire - and without DRS he doesn't look anywhere near as confident). |
I haven't seen Clarke's but Hussey and yesterday Marsh were absolute howlers, I mean even my nephew who is 5 years old can say that it is not out. Pathetic from Dharmasena. The one which Aleem dar gave (of Ashwin) was close, I mean it just looked out although replays showed the ball might be going down.
No where to go for India now though 166/6, losing 2 wickets in the last three overs to eliminate any interest whatsoever left in this game, great result for Australia though... w e may well have seen the last innings from Laxman and perhaps even Dravid, India's next test match is in July... good 6 months from now.
... and for those who don't know India play their last ODI of 2012 in March! 
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God is a better planner... so whenever u'r plan fails, cheer up... God has a better plan for you!
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mystery
Opener
Joined: 15 January 2008
Posts: 2140
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Posted: 27 January 2012 at 8:04pm |
Originally posted by BackwardPoint
spin - Sharma is more talented than Kohli but
Kohli's aggression and temperament gives him the edge. In terms of pure
ability, Sharma still wins for me.
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But talent alone is not enough. Some big news is Dravid will announce his retirement after this match. He is one of my fav players will really miss him and Kohli's run out just proved that Indian team is all lost really why would you want to take a single to get on strike when the nightwatchman is there and i want to ask why do umpires check for the no ball whenever Indian batsman gets out but they never check when India are bowling.
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Rohit Sharma - What the world has seen is gear 1, gear speed 2,3,4,5,7,8,9 to be witnessed in IPL only.
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spin wizard
Opening Bowler
The worlds next great spinner
Joined: 21 January 2006
Location: Saint Vincent
Posts: 9453
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Posted: 28 January 2012 at 12:56am |
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Watch a year india have had. Winning the WC then being trouble by even the West Indies. VVS and Dravid clearly needs to go. Dravid had such a great tour of England, I was thinking he'd be the same here but I was so wrong, and I found the England bowlers to be more challenging.
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In troubled times, being philosophical helps a great deal, it helps you to remain sane and not do any further damage.
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sam_ahmed
Middle-Order Batsman
Joined: 27 November 2007
Location: India
Posts: 4363
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Posted: 28 January 2012 at 2:45am |
AUS complete 4-0 whitewash, even Lyon got 4 wickets this time, well done to him, the Aussies bowled beautifully right throughout. They deserved a 4-0 result.
Dravid is almost certain to announce his retirement, he has played his last test match, wonderful player and an extraordinary career this man had. For India, well that time of rebuilding has come, many of us thought what will happen to India when the big players leave, that time has come now, only difference is that before they could leave the big players have ensured that India cannot do worse after they go!
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God is a better planner... so whenever u'r plan fails, cheer up... God has a better plan for you!
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MalhotraRaj84
Opener
Joined: 13 April 2009
Location: India1
Posts: 2204
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Posted: 28 January 2012 at 4:20am |
Fantastic win for Australia  .
Yes Spinney, it was a great year to begin but it slowly waned out.
Winning the World Cup was one of the biggest and most important thing on the TODO list, which I would never ever trade for any Test Series  , post that immediately IPL was bit of an overdose.Then came the two overseas test losses.Though these two series loss will deeply hurt atleast till we exchange similar plesentaries untill AUS and ENG visit India for Test Series.
As I had said long long time ago that Laxman and Dravid can be replaced and there are capable replacements who can take their place, infact do a better job, none of them believed me.
5 months is an awful long time and current Indian batsman can come out of their wretched batting form by then, lucky that we aren't playing any Test series immediately at home for that we would have lost that aswell, unless they would have drafted in youngsters like Rohit and Pujara.
The only positive that I can see is Kohli case, he got the rope long enough to establish himslef, but I still maintian it was a terrible selection to not to play Rohit in the pecking order.We could see what one little partership could do to team total. Anyway these are bygones and there is absolutely no use pondering about what would have happend if they had got selection right.
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Race to No 1 again ... started!
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Mikey
First Slip
Joined: 28 March 2011
Location: Australia
Posts: 949
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Posted: 28 January 2012 at 5:35am |
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It's nice to win a World Cup, but India has already done that before - and to do it at home really wasn't that great of an achievement. Any glory from the World Cup win should be clearly overshadowed by the pathetic display by this 'great' batting line up and the complete lack of mental application and strength to play test cricket away from home.
Let's be honest, we can keep talking about so-called 'green wickets', but pretty much none of the wickets were green, particularly Sydney and Adelaide. Australia are playing on the same surfaces and fact is, India were losing wickets to bad balls throughout the whole series. Absolutely no application or confidence whatsoever- they rolled over and gave up after losing in Melbourne. You hear Gambhir making comments that India should prepare raging turners, but let's be fair, India don't have great spinners any more and Australia has already won in India before - even without Ponting.
Gambhir , Laxman and Dravid all need to go, and Dhoni has to be stripped of his test captaincy. Wholesale changes are needed, otherwise India will just be another minnow.
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MalhotraRaj84
Opener
Joined: 13 April 2009
Location: India1
Posts: 2204
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Posted: 28 January 2012 at 6:47am |
Originally posted by Mikey
pathetic display by this 'great' batting line up and the complete lack of mental application and strength to play test cricket away from home. |
This is the first season in last 10 years they have looked out of place when touring abroad.
To be honest this is a collective lack of form that has spread like a wildfire.Laxman, Dravid, Gautam, Shewag and Tendulkar none of these have played to any near what they are capable of.
Originally posted by Mikey
Let's be honest, we can keep talking about so-called 'green wickets', but pretty much none of the wickets were green, particularly Sydney and Adelaide. Australia are playing on the same surfaces and fact is, India were losing wickets to bad balls throughout the whole series.
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Absolutely , this has got nothing to do with conditions or technique.They have lost in conditions which were very similar to what we get in Indian pitches.
Originally posted by Mikey
You hear Gambhir making comments that India should prepare raging turners |
What is wrong in square turners ? Absolutely fine with pitches that turn from day 1 , first session, first ball. Pick three spinners - as simple as that. Anyone who complains is of 'sour grapes'category.
When 4 seamers are player in WACA and other pitches , infact 70% of the times we have 3 Fast bowlers and 1 spinner , what is wrong in 1 fast bowlers and 3 spinners?
Pitch in never doctored mid match , captains get to see the pitch well in advance and there is no restriction to pick 3 spinners. Isn't it?
Originally posted by Mikey
Australia has already won in India before - even without Ponting. |
Seriously with Ponting in XI at that time, Aussies might not have won. Only in last Indian tour (2010) series he scored few runs in India, but it was not conclusive.
Originally posted by Mikey
Gambhir , Laxman and Dravid all need to go, and |
Gambhir is out of form , you never chop and change a young long term player are out of form. (who has got 5-6 years still left)
Originally posted by Mikey
Dhoni has to be stripped of his test captaincy.Wholesale changes are needed, otherwise India will just be another minnow. |
Expect for Laxman and Dravid , there is nothing else that needs a change. Entire batting line up is playing like Shaun Marsh+20/30 runs, you can't help but wait till they come back to form, except bringing in Rohit Sharma and Pujara in.
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Race to No 1 again ... started!
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MalhotraRaj84
Opener
Joined: 13 April 2009
Location: India1
Posts: 2204
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Posted: 28 January 2012 at 7:05am |
Fantastic series for Ponting & Hussey, they might have booked tickets to next Ashes, which in a way might backfire in long run. I see similar things happening to Australia with Hussey and Ponting holding on till next Ashes in England ( Like what happened with India holding onto Laxman and Dravid).
With these scintillating performances from Ponting and Hussey , they will surely play for entire 2012 (surely would score few career extending knocks inbetween), by then end of 2012 ... even if they run into bad form, Clarke and CA selectors will hope that they will come good and bet on their experience in England for Ashes tour.
Bright spots for sure are Warner & Pattinson (which was no surpise to me),Warner will have hot and cold seasons but he will be worth a bet in long run.Marsh will come good , no doubts about it.Hope that Austraian selectors will give him an extend rope.
"Pattinson", what a player ... no doubt , he is the best fast bowler that I have seen since Steyn, no one even comes close to this guy.
Edited by MalhotraRaj84 - 28 January 2012 at 7:10am
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Race to No 1 again ... started!
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Gabbar Singh
Trialist
Joined: 28 January 2012
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 1
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Posted: 28 January 2012 at 11:09am |
Prophetic in some ways because India have been battered again. But it could have been a different story if the young brigade had been uninhibitedly introduced viz. Ajinke Rahane and Rohit Sharma (batting). Perhaps a later tour will accommodate the other Sharma (Rahul I think) with Anil Kumble-like properties of leg-break economy and precision. Our “mediocre” pacemen ( Ishant Sharma and Umesh Yadav) were at one point bowling at 150 kmps from both ends , an unprecedented sight, as Wasim Akram said! (He was probably absent from Perth a few seasons ago). There are others in the reserve pool and with more support on the field from fresher legs once the transition period sees the ageing seniors through, you can expect the Ganguly-era pluck to return.
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MalhotraRaj84
Opener
Joined: 13 April 2009
Location: India1
Posts: 2204
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Posted: 28 January 2012 at 3:32pm |
Hey Gabbar, with the legendary nickname ... Welcome to this forum.
I agree on the two sharmas, Rohit(for sure) and Rahul have good future. Maybe in future for Test at India, Ashwin and Rahul Sharma might be the new spinning pair.
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Race to No 1 again ... started!
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spin wizard
Opening Bowler
The worlds next great spinner
Joined: 21 January 2006
Location: Saint Vincent
Posts: 9453
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Posted: 28 January 2012 at 6:45pm |
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Raj, when will you accept that it was the right thing to play Kohli ahead of Rohit? Haven't Kohli performed much better than Rohit in the international arena and showed great character to be ahead of Rohit? Carl Hooper was one of the best batsman to watch, Chanderpaul far more uglier but one ended up way ahead of the next!
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In troubled times, being philosophical helps a great deal, it helps you to remain sane and not do any further damage.
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Mikey
First Slip
Joined: 28 March 2011
Location: Australia
Posts: 949
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Posted: 28 January 2012 at 7:22pm |
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Hussey won us the series in SL and he contributed heavily in this series, the 3rd highest rungetter for Australia. I don't think he'll play after this year , he'll be phased our soon and maybe just stick to a limited overs career. He's a brilliant T20 cricketer, and I think he'll be the kind of guy who'll play til he's well over 40 in domestic T20 cricket tournaments. I do, however, think that he won't be playing test cricket past the age of 37. The other 'older' guy, Brad Haddin, will surely be replaced for the Windies series - it would be a huge blunder to stick with him. There's a whole lot of FC cricket coming up now in Australia, the best keeper out of that lot should be picked. While Ponting is really the only 'great' in this Australia side, arguable India are playing 4 (Sehwag, Sachin, VVS and Dravid)... so you can afford to keep a guy like that in the side, especially when the top 3 are younger and less experienced. For me, I think youth is important in your pace battery and Australia's fast bowlers, barring Harris (although I think he's exceptional) are under 30 and Cummins is in his teens. Whereas with the batting, once you remove Haddin from the picture, you've really only got a couple of 35+ guys there.
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mystery
Opener
Joined: 15 January 2008
Posts: 2140
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Posted: 28 January 2012 at 7:42pm |
Originally posted by spin wizard
Raj, when will you accept that it was the right thing to play Kohli ahead of Rohit? Haven't Kohli performed much better than Rohit in the international arena and showed great character to be ahead of Rohit? Carl Hooper was one of the best batsman to watch, Chanderpaul far more uglier but one ended up way ahead of the next! |
He will NEVER!!
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Rohit Sharma - What the world has seen is gear 1, gear speed 2,3,4,5,7,8,9 to be witnessed in IPL only.
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BackwardPoint
Square Leg
Joined: 02 November 2011
Posts: 307
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Posted: 29 January 2012 at 6:23am |
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Dravid has not taken a decision on retiring, opting instead to take it
one series at a time so all those saying he would retire were obviously
wrong. Unless they get forcibly pushed out, which is highly unlikely, I
can't see them voluntarily retiring for at least another year or year
and a half. Especially since there is the opportunity to fill their
boots at home for the next few series.
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Mikey
First Slip
Joined: 28 March 2011
Location: Australia
Posts: 949
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Posted: 29 January 2012 at 6:35am |
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Problem with Indians is that they strive too much for individual accolades and records and forget that cricket is a TEAM sport. This mentality is also transferred to fan, who would rather their favourite player gets a 200 than the captain declaring and ensuring a win is possible.
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sam_ahmed
Middle-Order Batsman
Joined: 27 November 2007
Location: India
Posts: 4363
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Posted: 29 January 2012 at 7:46am |
I agree Mikey that thing is there in India and Indian players and I'd say even in Pakistan to an extent, although now when Pak are playing as a team we can see how well they are performing.
The individuals, I don't know why are very greedy, I mean I don't why can't Dravid, VVS or even Sachin hang up their boots? Players like Badrinath, Kaif, and many others lost their entire careers hoping that the seniors will some day retire, now at least lets not ruin the future of other young players who are at their peak.
Kohli is a better player than Rohit. I don't think any one player could have changed the result of this series or even a game but yes poor selection was one of the reasons why India didn't do well, somewhere at Perth or at least Adelaide they should have played Rohit Sharma instead of Dravid or VVS. Just to test him and give him some experience.
The seniors have made it clear that they will not retire, rumors are that Dhoni will lose captaincy to Sehwag, in fact Times of India writes that "Sehwag likely to replace Dhoni as test captain". I'm not too sure if India are moving in the right direction here.
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God is a better planner... so whenever u'r plan fails, cheer up... God has a better plan for you!
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Mikey
First Slip
Joined: 28 March 2011
Location: Australia
Posts: 949
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Posted: 29 January 2012 at 10:12am |
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Dhoni was pathetic this series, from his comments in the media, his ordinary keeping, his inadequate batting technique and his atrocious captaincy. I actually think Dhoni will not play a hell of a lot more test cricket and nor do I think he really wants to. Sehwag is NO real solution as captain, and only 4 overseas tons in his whole career, as well only 1 ton in the second innings of a test match really tells the true picture of Sehwag - a flat track bully with a very limited technique and no imagination as skipper. He's not a match winner, he's what I call a 'session winner'.
India have to make serious changes in test cricket - in ODIs their team looks a lot better and united and that is highly correlated to the true mix of youth and experience in the side.
Edited by Mikey - 29 January 2012 at 10:14am
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BackwardPoint
Square Leg
Joined: 02 November 2011
Posts: 307
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Posted: 29 January 2012 at 10:17am |
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Good point Mikey, I agree.
I honestly can't believe VVS is still being kept. They should have replaced him at Perth, very realistically at Adelaide and at the very least, at the completion of the series. Now he will play for 2 more years at home and make hay and selectors will say they can't drop him when he is making so many runs. sam, if they give the captaincy to Sehwag then it will be almost as big a debacle as Dilshan. He won't lead from the front, he will keep giving away his wicket cheaply and his tactical nous is virtually non-existent. I don't really know who can take over from Dhoni though, maybe someone like Kohli as early as it is. Just not Sehwag.
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Mikey
First Slip
Joined: 28 March 2011
Location: Australia
Posts: 949
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Posted: 29 January 2012 at 10:25am |
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The worst thing that happened to India is this schedule they have for the next two years - I can't actually believe they're not playing away at all. If they're clever, they'll use the next two years to blood young players slowly into the side while playing at home and give the oldies a home farewell.
Two comments that annoyed me most was Gambhir's excuse about the conditions and Sehwag talking about beating Australia in 2010, when they were really a 'dead' side back then, 2-0 at home - if that's a consolation for him then I really do pity him.
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sam_ahmed
Middle-Order Batsman
Joined: 27 November 2007
Location: India
Posts: 4363
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Posted: 29 January 2012 at 3:56pm |
Sehwag seems to be the most likely option as per reports from some newspapers BP, apparently there is some ego clash between Dhoni and Sehwag and Dhoni doesn't seem to have enough control on senior players like Sehwag and a few others, but all these are rumors, media writes a lot more than what it actually is. Then again we can't say for sure that everything is well either, all these rumors might be true!
also It's not that India don't play "away" series at all for next two years Mikey, it's that they don't play in foreign conditions (away from the subcontinent). They have 2 away series scheduled during this period, one against SLN in June this year and one against Pakistan in July next year.
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God is a better planner... so whenever u'r plan fails, cheer up... God has a better plan for you!
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Sledger
Captain
Dickenson can marry my mother-in-law !
Joined: 08 August 2005
Location: South Africa
Posts: 15694
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Posted: 30 January 2012 at 7:24am |
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There doesn't appear to be a natural successor to Dhoni , if he goes. I can't see Sehwag in the role , he just hasn't the cricket nous in my opinion. It's crucial that the BCCI address the problems , dismantle this side and look to the future. But from what I've read their heads are in the sand and unless some of the old hands retire they'll not be any wholesale changes. What will precipitate change is a series hammering in India - that might wake 'em up !
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Mental disintegration works for me !!
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sam_ahmed
Middle-Order Batsman
Joined: 27 November 2007
Location: India
Posts: 4363
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Posted: 30 January 2012 at 6:02pm |
Originally posted by Sledger
What will precipitate change is a series hammering in India - that might wake 'em up !
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... and if the same old players play, I don't rule out that possiblity sledge, both NZL and ENG their home opponents this year are tough sides, esp if ENG can work out something against spin after their poor showing against PAK.
If I remember correctly, Nasser Hussain's ENG in 2002 and Andrew Flintoff's ENG in 2006 played well against IND in IND, and I remember then doing exceptionally well in SLN too in 2006/07, even wiining an ODI series in SLN, what happened all of a sudden then? I mean they weren't as clueless as they look now.
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God is a better planner... so whenever u'r plan fails, cheer up... God has a better plan for you!
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zuhair_abbasi
Number 3 Batsman
Joined: 19 December 2006
Location: Pakistan
Posts: 6202
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Posted: 31 January 2012 at 6:52am |
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Back then they had Graham Thorpe mate
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http://thecricketinsight.blogspot.com/
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BackwardPoint
Square Leg
Joined: 02 November 2011
Posts: 307
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Posted: 31 January 2012 at 4:17pm |
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I also expect India to do rather well in the upcoming T20 and CB series matches. Their bowling won't be so severely exposed and many of their players' natural games are better suited to the shorter formats. These good performances may gloss over their atrocious performances in the Tests and soon all will be forgotten about.
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