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spin wizard View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Australia vs. India (in Australia)
    Posted: 26 December 2011 at 7:33pm
Payback for Sydney 2008??? 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 December 2011 at 7:35am
I don't understand how it's payback, Australia didn't control the action of the umpires in 2008. In this series, DRS was available and the Nine Network has the best technology, with regards to cameras and frames per second available for ball tracker. It's an absolute joke to be frank that the Indians can get away without having technology being used and it has definitely cost Australia from making over 400. Bit of a double standard to be honest to allow for the incompetent umpire to check for a no ball via the 3rd umpire, but not allow Hussey or Cowan refer their decisions.

In saying that, have we seen the same sort of tantrums from the Aussies as we saw from the Indians in 2008? Certainly not....
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 December 2011 at 8:38am
Indians in command at stumps on day 2. The big guns have come good - and more to come from Laxman, Kohli and the not out Wall. They could have played an all pace attack with Clarke doing the spin duty. Playing Lyon is not going to do any good to his future prospects - the Indians will absolutely maul him.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 December 2011 at 9:08am
Definitely need 5 bowlers against India, I don't know what the selectors are thinking to be honest. In addition, I don't think Dan Christian is the man to be considered when looking at playing a 5th bowler. I'd much rather see someone like Andrew McDonald who has been in marvellous batting form for 2 years now and who is a wicket to wicket seam bowler play, then the erratic Dan Christian. Or even Butterworth, who has been doing a great job for Tasmania for some time.

In saying that, Watson should be back in the 2nd test and his bowling will also be quite important. The fast men all bowled well, but the fielding and keeping was poor and cost the bowlers more chances. I thought Siddle was particularly impressive, despite the wicket on a no ball, he hit 150kph at the END of the day and was bowling with controlled pace. He bowled better than his figures suggest. Pattinson was also particularly fast and was given the Indians some trouble, while Gambhir had no idea how to play Hilfenhaus.

For me, it was poor fielding and excellent batting that made the day India's... not necessarily bad bowling. Having a young spinner certainly doesn't help, but even so, Warne wasn't that effective against India anyway.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 December 2011 at 5:24pm
India in control but I won't count out an Australian fightback at the moment, esp with sachin gone, a couple of wickets tomorrow morning first hour and AUS could be right back in it. This should be an absorbing test match I reckon.

I agree with Mikey, not using the DRS but allowing the umpire to check on the no-ball by making use of technology is absolutely ridiculous and not on, I mean I'm just taking fair, you cannot have double standards like this.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 December 2011 at 4:06am
Agree with everything Sam has said, and he has been spot on. Australia got a couple of wickets and somehow have taken a lead. But nonetheless, the Indians have mitigated the efforts of Hilfenhaus, who has surprisingly nabbed his maiden 5 wicket haul, by taking 4 big wickets. Ponting and Hussey have both made starts now, and if they do get on with it, which is the hope for Australian fans, then the match will be close. Fascinating game, and the fact that Hussey might lose his spot if Watson comes back in the next test means he HAS to make runs. Otherwise Cowan will keep his spot, after a wonderful 68 in the first innings.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 December 2011 at 5:54am
Ponting goes for another 60 in the match. It should feel like a hundred to him. It is going to be a cracker this one Aussies 200 in lead with 5 wickets down. Really anyone's game. India's batting is pretty good to chase anything within 300
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 December 2011 at 6:18am
We've been saying that India's batting is good enough to chase anything near 300 (and it is) but I think their Test line-up is really living on reputation in recent times. Even against WI, their batting looked a bit frail. No one seems to be prepared (barring Dravid) to knuckle down and play a sensible innings. AUS bowling looks class, Siddle has come along a lot in recent times. What a wonderful return for Hilfenhaus and Pattinson is still looking great. If AUS can set IND about 275-300, I fancy AUS for the win. Hell, even 250, I think AUS will win.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 December 2011 at 12:58pm
Interesting Test match doing on.  Can't really say who is going to win. 200 odd runs to win in the last innings always mean the bowling team has a chance.  India is good at chasing.

If the surface is up and down, Pattinson will be extremely hard to negotiate.  In theory, the pitch now should favour India's batting more than the first innings as with wear, it starts to be a bit more sub continent like.

And, Zaheer Khan doing as I expected.  Still not fully fit but still causing problems to everyone.

Also, i'm very impressed by Pattinson.  Looks an old fashion fast bowler, tall, wrist behind ball, sending it down on the seam, good areas, movement off the seam.  So far, the signs are ominous for opposing team, but, as I always say, its never good to judge after a few test match.


Edited by spin wizard - 28 December 2011 at 1:00pm
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 December 2011 at 1:10pm
Australia need 300 otherwise its looks very hard and Sehwag will be very important if he gets out early than India will be in big trouble if he gets a start than it will be a easy chase for India i just hope they dont drop any catches which is a habit for them now and Milky i just saw that Watson might miss the full series is it true? they are missing Watson's bowling on this track it was a perfect pitch for him.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 December 2011 at 3:17pm
Australia's bowling bar Lyon hasn't been a problem this game.  Dismissing India for 280 odd is a good effort.  The batting has been the major let down.  Still no one outside of Hussey and Watson scoring runs consistently.  That's where Watson is badly missed.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 December 2011 at 4:09pm
Australia's bowling has been very impressive, no doubt about that and they have the pace battery to do the damage. I dare say if Harris is fit in the next game that Lyon may be dropped, as having no spinner against India is NOT a sing, by all means...
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 December 2011 at 4:40pm
Harris seems to be like Jerome Taylor, they can't complete one full series.  I think Australia should look pass him until he can demonstrate the ability to stay fit, because with him in and out, it will keep on upsetting a stable line up.  Stable teams perform better.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 December 2011 at 5:23pm
Australia have wasted a very good opportunity to bat India out of this game, the way Marsh and Warner got out was unnecessary, chasing wide deliveries and dragging them onto their stumps, even Cowan leaving a very straight ball was very strange, it just looked plumb although Hawk eye suggested I might have still missed off. I think had Australia batted more sensibly they could have had India on the mat.

However, I'd still fancy Australia winning this one, if, as mystery has rightly pointed out, they take their catches and they Sehwag early. Sehwag is one man who can take the game away from you very quickly esp. in a short chase like this, a quick fire 50 can make all the difference. Sehwag's wicket is the key, and the catching needs to be spot on. 

One more thing, Australia's innings is still not over, and of all people Hussey is still there, perhaps the best man to have in a situation like this, a lot will also depend on how many more runs the Aussies can get, there is a big difference between chasing a 230-240 and chasing a 280-290.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 December 2011 at 9:02pm
Dravid has shelled a lot of catches in the slips in recent times. A sign that the reflexes are not as good as they once were? Slip catches are absolutely vital, it may be time to start getting new faces in the slip cordon.

Really disappointing by AUS. As sam said, some really unnecessary and poor dismissals. I rate Marsh very highly but his wicket at a crucial time got India right back in the game. It would be nice to see him tighten up a bit outside off stump. Zaheer has looked extremely impressive tbh, still bowling within himself in terms of pace but accuracy, swing, nous - all of the highest quality. Easily 3rd best bowler in world cricket, behind Anderson and Steyn at no.1.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 December 2011 at 9:16pm
Yep BP, Zaheer has been one of the best bowlers in the world for sometime.  He's doing the business all over the world.  Its a shame he only bowled in one game in England, I think England wouldn't have scored as much as they did that often, but that's in thoughts, what would have really happened, we don't know.

Hussey again saving Australia, yet people is always talking about Hussey could be dropped.  Why do they keep on speculating on Hussey's spot, when for the last 2 years, he and Watson has been doing all the scoring.  2 or 3 bad series and that negates all his good work.  Age should never be a factor, as long as a man is performing, he should never be thrown out, unless he retires or causing trouble in the camp.  You play sports to win at all cost, not to blood younger players.  If pure 37 year old will win it for you, play them.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2011 at 12:55am
some problem with my laptop meant that I was awake almost entire night :( finally able to resolve it though, all by myself :) and was able to watch some cricket!

As I had expected Australia were resilient, 292 to win now for India and although it wasn't hussey, the last two batsmen did a wonderful job. Big task this now for India,I won't be easy by any means, India have chased well in the past but this one in Melbourne is going to be difficult.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2011 at 1:15am
Good to see you up Sam i just love watching cricket at night. Pattinson again looking impressive hope he gets Sehwag soon.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2011 at 1:20am
And he is goneeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2011 at 6:20am
Originally posted by spin wizard

Yep BP, Zaheer has been one of the best bowlers in the world for sometime.  
I beg to disagree. He can be impressive in short bursts - but he does nto have the killer blow that others like Steyn or Anderson have. Zaheer's numbers also tell the story - they are far from impressive. He is INDIA's best quick at the moment and nothing more in my book. Not one of the best around - never was.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2011 at 6:21am
What an impressive win for the Aussies. They fought back well after India had posted 214/3 on day 2. If their batsmen show more muscle, it could well be a repeat of England tour for the mighty Indians. And I will take that.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2011 at 6:24am
I agree with Zuhair, you guys haven't watched the match. Zaheer bowled 4 or 5 good balls in about 5 overs... how does that make him top 3 in the world? What about Philander, Pattinson, Harris? Zaheer looks overweight and his pace is military medium. He had good numbers , but the wicket was also quite good for his style of bowling. Yadav, however, impressed me with his lively pace and stamina. Looks a decent find actually.


Anyway, great win by the Aussies. Best attack since Warne and McGrath retired. Also, Ponting has made 4 50s in his last 6 innings... not bad!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2011 at 8:02am
How can guys like Philander and Pattinson be top 3 bowlers in the world? They've both played 3 Test matches and while they have enjoyed much success (deserved success I might add), you can't say a bloke is 3rd Test bowler in the world after 3 matches. That's just ludicrous for you to even suggest it. If some guy comes along and gets a couple of centuries in his first couple of Tests, it would be insane to run around saying he is a top 3 Test match batsmen. To be at or near the top of the list, you have to maintain consistency and success over some period of time. Philander and Pattinson both look very promising but give them at least 10 Test matches including matches in different conditions, on different surfaces, in different countries before you start judging their relative skill against other more experienced bowlers. Same applies to Harris, he has played less than 10 Test matches.

Also, just because I have reached different conclusions to you, that doesn't mean I haven't watched the game. Firstly, he didn't look as chubby as he did in England. He appears to have slimmed down and even if he isn't the fittest around, that isn't a reflection on his skill level. Again, same applies to his pace. He was certainly down on his pace but that again isn't a reflection on his skill level. One of your suggested alternatives in Philander also bowls at a similar pace. Zaheer looked threatening for spells in the game, bowled troubling lines, swung the ball, offered control and accuracy. I questioned whether he would be match fit but he performed well. The wicket did aid him but you still have to bowl well to get wickets and he certainly bowled well.

I don't think Zaheer is as good as Steyn and Anderson zuhair, Steyn and Anderson are superior and by a considerable distance in my opinion. Having said that, Zaheer is still third best. If someone is contesting that then I suggest some other names be presented (and not bowlers who have played 3 games).
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2011 at 8:05am
As expected, India wilted. Much hyped batting line-up failing to deliver again although the AUS bowling was of a high standard. Gambhir looked completely out of sorts and has done for a considerable amount of time now. May be worth dropping him, having Sehwag and Dravid open and slotting Rohit Sharma into the middle order.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2011 at 8:15am
Here are the names mate - Bresnan, Finn, Morkel, Siddle - they are all ahead of Zaheer in my view. Zaheer for me is a good handy bowler who can be best grouped with the likes of Gul, Broad, Martin etc. Good on him - the two match fixers have rightly been jailed - or else he would not have found himself featuring anywhere in the top 6-7.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2011 at 8:58am
Siddle seems to have improved a lot (I was never really impressed by him) but I wouldn't say he is ahead of Zaheer. Bresnan looks a quality bowler but he also hasn't been a part of England's first team for too long. His figures are augmented slightly because he has played 3 Tests against BANG (and enjoyed success). While his returns in the last 2 Ashes Tests and India series are very impressive, I would still pick Zaheer ahead of him. He can be better than Zaheer but not yet.

Morkel is an unplayable bowler when in red hot form and Finn is the best young bowling talent in world cricket imo. I rate them both very highly. They are very different to Zaheer so it's hard to compare them. Zaheer is all about swing and accuracy, Finn/Morkel are more about pace and bounce. Can't really compare but I don't mind someone saying they are better than Zaheer. Morkel is prone to inconsistency (as his current form indicates) but I can concede that Morkel on his A game is probably better than Zaheer. Finn is class and if he gets more Test match opportunities for England over the next couple of years, I can also see him being better than Zaheer but he hasn't been given an extended run yet so can't say for definite that he is ahead of Zaheer. All in all, at this current stage in the development of all those bowlers, Zaheer still ranks at the top. He has more experience and nous, which gives him the edge. In a couple of years, maybe all of them will definitely be ahead of Zaheer, who knows but not right now.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2011 at 9:30am
I'm looking at ability. What Zaheer is doing is not unique. Left arm over the wicket, at 130kph with a bit of movement. He ain't producing any magic anymore mate. I'm with Zuhair, other guys have taken over Zaheer and I think the 3 guys I have mentioned will also rise to the top, particularly Pattinson.

Edited by Mikey - 29 December 2011 at 10:54am
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2011 at 5:35pm
Originally posted by Zuhair_abbasi

I beg to disagree. He can be impressive in short bursts - but he does nto have the killer blow that others like Steyn or Anderson have. Zaheer's numbers also tell the story - they are far from impressive. He is INDIA's best quick at the moment and nothing more in my book. Not one of the best around - never was.


Zuhair, are you sure you want to see Zaheer's numbers?  Since the beginning of 2009, Zaheer has played 18 matches, 83 wkts, average of around 25 and strike rate of 47.  Now tell me, what's not great about these numbers?  Don't let the India/Pakistan rivalry get to you mate.  Zaheer has been one of the best seamers for the last 2 years. 

9 Matches in India, average of 28 with strike rate of 51.
9 matches away from India, average of 23, strike rate of 43.

Tell me, what's not so great about these numbers?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2011 at 5:43pm
Superb win for the Aussies, a strong performance that will make India wonder if they can really win a game this series. The old Indian middle order showed up, Dravid is out clean bowled 3 times in 2 innings (once off a No Ball), now that is not the wall we know, these are old players who won't be winning any games for India abroad at this age.

Having said that Indian youngsters are ven worse, Kohli fails again, Dhoni, well in tests he is nothing more than ordinary, I have hardly, if ever, seen him do well in tests, in fact I can't remember a single innings of his which can be called as a class act in test matches  and he has been around since almost 7 years now.

Pattinson without a shadow of a doubt is one of the brightest young fast bowlers around, along with Cummins and Siddle (a much improved Siddle) they can form the core of the Australian attack and not to forget Hilfy, who too was mighty impressive.

I think Pattinson, Cummins, Junaid Khan, Umesh Yadav, Doug Bracewell and Steven Finn are among the finest upcoming fast bowling talents and it is a delight to see such good young fast bowlers!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2011 at 5:45pm
Originally posted by BackwardPoint

Siddle seems to have improved a lot (I was never really impressed by him) but I wouldn't say he is ahead of Zaheer. Bresnan looks a quality bowler but he also hasn't been a part of England's first team for too long. His figures are augmented slightly because he has played 3 Tests against BANG (and enjoyed success). While his returns in the last 2 Ashes Tests and India series are very impressive, I would still pick Zaheer ahead of him. He can be better than Zaheer but not yet.

Morkel is an unplayable bowler when in red hot form and Finn is the best young bowling talent in world cricket imo. I rate them both very highly. They are very different to Zaheer so it's hard to compare them. Zaheer is all about swing and accuracy, Finn/Morkel are more about pace and bounce. Can't really compare but I don't mind someone saying they are better than Zaheer. Morkel is prone to inconsistency (as his current form indicates) but I can concede that Morkel on his A game is probably better than Zaheer. Finn is class and if he gets more Test match opportunities for England over the next couple of years, I can also see him being better than Zaheer but he hasn't been given an extended run yet so can't say for definite that he is ahead of Zaheer. All in all, at this current stage in the development of all those bowlers, Zaheer still ranks at the top. He has more experience and nous, which gives him the edge. In a couple of years, maybe all of them will definitely be ahead of Zaheer, who knows but not right now.

The argument on Zaheer Khan... I think the above post by BP just sums it up perfectly, I'm with BP on this one.
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