Foreign languages
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Topic: Foreign languages
Posted By: spin wizard
Subject: Foreign languages
Date Posted: 28 April 2011 at 2:30pm
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My ambition to learn urdu has lead me ask, how much here knows more than one language quite well? The asians would be the most skilled at this as they have different languages.
How many languages do our fellow Asians on here know? Was it difficult to learn another language? ------------- In troubled times, being philosophical helps a great deal, it helps you to remain sane and not do any further damage. |
Replies:
Posted By: zuhair_abbasi
Date Posted: 28 April 2011 at 2:54pm
| I know Arabic, Persian and German other than my mother tongue Urdu. it was not much difficult to learn Arabic and Persian as i was taught that at a young age. German was a tough thing - and I am still learning that. |
Posted By: Mikey
Date Posted: 28 April 2011 at 4:18pm
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I'm looking at learning Hebrew at the moment. I've always had an interest in Semitic languages. It's got a lot of similarities with Arabic and Aramaic, quite interesting. Both Hebrew and Arabic work on the concept of root words, unlike in English. Reading and writing Arabic however, is much, much more difficult than Hebrew. Hebrew there is just upper and lower case, and one does not connect the letters. Whereas in Arabic, the letters are different when isolated, at the start,in the middle or at the end of the word. Zuhair would have a decent grasp on reading Persian, Urdu and Arabic as they are written with the same Arabic alphabet, but with slight differences with some letters to account for different sounds, etc. In saying that though, just because one can read English doesn't mean they can understand Italian. They are totally different languages. That's why, like for Zuhair, learning from a young age meant he picked up on the languages with minimal difficulty. |
Posted By: spin wizard
Date Posted: 28 April 2011 at 6:23pm
Zuhair, my oldest brother is currently learning German from some German tourist that he drives very often. They are regular visitors here and he has learned quite a bit from them over the last few months. Seems like there are more languages in Asia alone than the rest of the world. 
Shab bakhair Zuhair.
 ------------- In troubled times, being philosophical helps a great deal, it helps you to remain sane and not do any further damage. |
Posted By: Mikey
Date Posted: 28 April 2011 at 6:34pm
| Khair means good in Arabic, is that where the word comes from in Urdu? |
Posted By: sam_ahmed
Date Posted: 28 April 2011 at 7:21pm
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well most Indians are good at various languages but not me :(, I know Urdu and that is the language I speak at home, I'm good at Hindi and English too. all these three languages I can read, write and speak. I can read Arabic and understand only a little bit, I can't speak, I can read and write Telugu, the language of my state, and can understand fairly well, quite amazingly I can't speak Telugu. I mean I can read, write and understand but can't speak, may sound funny but it is true! ------------- God is a better planner... so whenever u'r plan fails, cheer up... God has a better plan for you! |
Posted By: zuhair_abbasi
Date Posted: 29 April 2011 at 6:47am
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Yss Mikey - khair means good - and Urdu has adopted this word from Arabic only. I go to a proper German language learning center and it is a full 20 month course. Subah Bakhair and marhaba
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Posted By: Sledger
Date Posted: 29 April 2011 at 7:24am
Your English isn't bad either zuhair !  ------------- Mental disintegration works for me !! |
Posted By: Sledger
Date Posted: 29 April 2011 at 7:27am
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I did French to "O" Level at school and know a little Afrikaans , but nowhere near as much as I should after 29 years in South Africa ! My excuse is that science's international language is English and I've always worked in institutions where English ruled the roost. A poor excuse really , but at heart I'm rather lazy and have many interests that don't tax me like learning a foreign language would! ------------- Mental disintegration works for me !! |
Posted By: zuhair_abbasi
Date Posted: 29 April 2011 at 7:31am
| Is English widely spoken in South Africa or is it just afrikaan? |
Posted By: Sledger
Date Posted: 29 April 2011 at 7:36am
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English is spoken by practically everyone in SA mate , only some very small rural areas won't use it. Quite amazingly most black South Africans can speak all the languages of the country - 13 in all !
------------- Mental disintegration works for me !! |
Posted By: zuhair_abbasi
Date Posted: 29 April 2011 at 7:48am
| Woosh - thirteen!!!! That's unlucky mate. |
Posted By: Mikey
Date Posted: 29 April 2011 at 8:44am
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From what I understood, English is virtually spoken by everyone in Africa, but only by about 10 or 15% as a first language. So that would make Sledger one of the minority who speaks English as a first language. South Africa is a very multilingual country, unlike Australia, quite normal for people to speak a few languages. That's the big shame about some of these Western nations. India is another country where people tend to speak quite a few languages as well! Is it right Sledger that English is the language of instruction in most universities in SA? |
Posted By: Mikey
Date Posted: 29 April 2011 at 8:45am
| Salam 3aleyk Zuhair!! Keef 7aluka? |
Posted By: Sledger
Date Posted: 29 April 2011 at 8:51am
It's the language of instruction in all universities now Mikey and has been for quite some time. ------------- Mental disintegration works for me !! |
Posted By: Mikey
Date Posted: 29 April 2011 at 8:53am
I was under the impression there was still a few Afrikaans universities around! Do you feel limited in SA by not having a great grasp of Afrikaans, or is one able to do fine with just English? Always been curious. I live in Perth and we have... A LOT of South Africans. |
Posted By: zuhair_abbasi
Date Posted: 29 April 2011 at 9:08am
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Posted By: Mikey
Date Posted: 29 April 2011 at 9:09am
| Do you know any dialects Zuhair? I know mostly Lebanese and Egyptian, which are probably the most used in media. But Egyptian is quite different from MSA (fusha). |
Posted By: zuhair_abbasi
Date Posted: 29 April 2011 at 9:18am
| We have the Syrian one as the most common used. I agree Egyptian is quite different |
Posted By: Mikey
Date Posted: 29 April 2011 at 9:23am
| Syrian is reasonably similar to Lebanese, but still distinct! Egyptian is written exactly the same, but the spoken Egyptian is almost like a different language, quite incredible really. But fact is, most Arabic speakers understand Egyptians almost 100%. |
Posted By: spin wizard
Date Posted: 29 April 2011 at 2:35pm
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Is Salam hello Zuhair? What about Assalamo Alaikom? ------------- In troubled times, being philosophical helps a great deal, it helps you to remain sane and not do any further damage. |
Posted By: vote4peace
Date Posted: 29 April 2011 at 2:43pm
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I aint proficient enough at urdu, but from what I know yes both are different synonyms of hello. My native tougue is malayalam which I can read, write and speak well. The other language that I can r\w and speak is Hindi, though being from the south not as fluent as you may think. i also can understand a bit of Tamil(mainly through watching their movies). ------------- I distrust a camel.. and anyone else who can go a week without a drink.
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Posted By: Mikey
Date Posted: 29 April 2011 at 3:56pm
| Salam means 'peace' in Arabic Spin, and is used by Urdu speakers as many are Muslims and "Salam aleykom" (meaning Peace to you --- by the way aleykon is plural) is a Muslim greeting (although equally used by Christians and Jews in the Arabic speaking countries). In fact, Shalom, which means peace in Hebrew is the same word as Salam. The letter 'shin' in Hebrew is equivalent to 'seen' in Arabic, and hence the difference in pronunciation. |
Posted By: sam_ahmed
Date Posted: 29 April 2011 at 5:30pm
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yup! Mikey is right, assalam alaikum means "peace be on you". ------------- God is a better planner... so whenever u'r plan fails, cheer up... God has a better plan for you! |
Posted By: spin wizard
Date Posted: 29 April 2011 at 7:56pm
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Lol, funny stuff here. So what is the word for if I want to say "hello" to someone or better yet, when i'm answering the phone and wants to say hello? ------------- In troubled times, being philosophical helps a great deal, it helps you to remain sane and not do any further damage. |
Posted By: -JP-
Date Posted: 30 April 2011 at 12:58am
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I have a degree in French although as I'm currently enjoying a weekend in France as my first time in the country for five years I'm a bit rusty. A few beers seems to have sorted things though. |
Posted By: spin wizard
Date Posted: 30 April 2011 at 6:14am
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Zuhair or Sam, how do you pronounce the "ai" for example in alAIkum, is it pronounced as "Lay E Koom" or just "Lay koom". Also in kAIsy, is it "Kay-e-say" or "key-say"?
Also, when "EI" comes together, is it pronounced as "A"? Like in the word "Mein", would that be "May"?
Think i've realised that "I" at the end of a word is prounced as "E" and also that words ending with "N", the N isn't pronounced. "U" is pronounced as "OO" and "E" as "A" ------------- In troubled times, being philosophical helps a great deal, it helps you to remain sane and not do any further damage. |
Posted By: zuhair_abbasi
Date Posted: 30 April 2011 at 6:43am
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Confusion confusion Spinny - roman ain't the best way to decode Urdu. Different people use different spellings. As for your first question - we pronounce LAI as one syllable - it si pronounced like when you see LEE - u just replace the middle E with A and that would be better. |
Posted By: Mikey
Date Posted: 30 April 2011 at 11:05am
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Does Urdu retain the 'ayn Zuhair? In Arabic it is Salaam AaaaaaLAYYkom. You need someone to show you how to pronounce this 'ayn for you to know what I mean. |
Posted By: zuhair_abbasi
Date Posted: 30 April 2011 at 11:09am
| Yes Urdu does retain the 'ayn' Mikey. I can't figure out a way of showing how do we pronounce it - you just have to listen to it to be able to pronounce |
Posted By: Mikey
Date Posted: 30 April 2011 at 11:21am
| It's a tricky little letter if you're not a native speaker. Bit of trivia, in Modern Hebrew they also have the 'ayn, but only the Arabs pronounce it when speaking Hebrew, as most modern Hebrew speakers are from Europe originally and couldn't say it. Thought that was interesting. I've never been to Israel though, so I'm not 100% sure, Hebrew is just a language I want to learn simply because it's similar to Arabic. |
Posted By: spin wizard
Date Posted: 30 April 2011 at 2:58pm
The part highlighted in bold would be pronounced in English as "Lay" as in laying an egg. I Listened to a middle eastern urdu speaker and for Assalam alaikom, it sounded as "Lay-E" (Say the word lay and E together is the best way to describe it) and for walaikum Salam it sounded as "Lee" (like Brett Lee). Maybe my ears is bad but probably different people from different region will even have some variation in pronounciation. For instance, most of us in the West Indies say "Hello" but there are some English folks that because of their accent you actually hear 'Ello.
------------- In troubled times, being philosophical helps a great deal, it helps you to remain sane and not do any further damage. |
Posted By: spin wizard
Date Posted: 01 May 2011 at 1:07am
Okay, I think i've got it now. Just brushed up on how the vowels are to be pronounced, it's a big help, things are much easier to understand now. Also learned about how sentences are shaped in terms of Subject, object then the verb. Mein Urdu Siiknii Ki Koshish Kaa Rahaa hun  ------------- In troubled times, being philosophical helps a great deal, it helps you to remain sane and not do any further damage. |
Posted By: Sledger
Date Posted: 04 May 2011 at 6:46am
Naw , I just tell 'em to speak a proper language ! Joking aside , there's probably more people using foreign languages in the UK than there is here in SA. I've travelled all around this country and have yet to find anyone who cannot converse in English. That wasn't always true when I lived in England , a bunch of us crossed the border into North Wales for some trout fishing back in the 1970's - we fished , then went for a pint in a nice little hostelry. It was pretty busy and the locals were all prattling in English until they heard our accents and immediately they switched to Welsh - gits !! ------------- Mental disintegration works for me !! |
Posted By: zuhair_abbasi
Date Posted: 05 May 2011 at 10:44am
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Posted By: spin wizard
Date Posted: 06 May 2011 at 4:43am
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------------- In troubled times, being philosophical helps a great deal, it helps you to remain sane and not do any further damage. |
Posted By: Sledger
Date Posted: 10 May 2011 at 10:01am
That must come in handy in your current job JP ! ------------- Mental disintegration works for me !! |
Posted By: Mikey
Date Posted: 10 May 2011 at 10:57am
Sometimes those folks are actually speaking English and I still can't decode what they're saying. Some of those Welsh and Gaelic folks have very harsh accents. |
Posted By: Mikey
Date Posted: 09 June 2011 at 5:20am
How's the language learning guys? Still a few more languages I want to learn, still trying to diffuse Arabic and Hebrew - I think I chose the two hardest languages in the world  . Should have stuck with Italian, which I learnt in High School times.
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Posted By: -JP-
Date Posted: 09 June 2011 at 11:58am
Absolument. France being the cricketing powerhouse that it is, of course. |
Posted By: kirankri
Date Posted: 10 June 2011 at 5:28am
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I can read/write/understand/speak only two languages. English and Kannada.
To answer Spinny, yes, it was difficult initially to learn English since the grammar of English and Indian languages are different.
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Posted By: zuhair_abbasi
Date Posted: 10 June 2011 at 6:43am
| Not even Hindi Kiran? That sounds strange - I thought everyone in India knows Hindi |
Posted By: Mikey
Date Posted: 10 June 2011 at 8:10am
| Can't imagine you could get very far in India without knowing Hindi. Even your Pakistani neighbours would do more than fine conversing in Urdu with their Indian counterparts. |
Posted By: kirankri
Date Posted: 10 June 2011 at 9:41am
No Zuhair. I can only understand some very very basic words.
Not many people in the 4 states of South India (which constitutes almost 30 crores) knows Hindi (specially our generation). Hyderabad is one exception in AP I guess. the current younger generation is exposed more to Hindi channels, so slightly better than us.
The advantage of that though is that, people here generally speak better English since we speak in English with people from other states. Even among the Indian cricketers you would have seen. Dravid/Kumble/Srinath/Laxman speak better English than Sehwag/RP Singh/Harbhajan and co. People from Mumbai (west) speak both the languages reasonably well.
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Posted By: kirankri
Date Posted: 10 June 2011 at 9:47am
Yes Mikey. Would be a bit difficult when I visit northern India. However, I have been to North only once in 37 years.
 |
Posted By: zuhair_abbasi
Date Posted: 10 June 2011 at 10:16am
| Woof - just ONCE!! then again, India is huge |
Posted By: Mikey
Date Posted: 10 June 2011 at 10:21am
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That's amazing. Then again, English seems to be more of a lingua franca in India. Everyone with reasonable education levels speaks it as a 2nd language, so you can use it when speaking to those from different states. How often do they use English as a language of instruction in Indian and Pakistan schools? I know they are both official languages in both nations. |
Posted By: zuhair_abbasi
Date Posted: 10 June 2011 at 10:30am
| The public schools still use Urdu as the medium of instruction - but all other schools use English - I would say around 80 percent. |
Posted By: spin wizard
Date Posted: 10 June 2011 at 4:38pm
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Pakistan mosam bhai zuhair kaisay hun?
Did I get that right zuhair? ------------- In troubled times, being philosophical helps a great deal, it helps you to remain sane and not do any further damage. |
Posted By: zuhair_abbasi
Date Posted: 11 June 2011 at 12:18pm
| Not exactly Spinny - but still a good try. Pakistan mayN mausam kesa hay Zuhair bhai is the more appropriate way of saying how is there weather in Pakistan Zuhair |
Posted By: spin wizard
Date Posted: 11 June 2011 at 2:48pm
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Ok. I had my urdu on break for a while as I had exams. Will be back in session from now on. ------------- In troubled times, being philosophical helps a great deal, it helps you to remain sane and not do any further damage. |
Posted By: sam_ahmed
Date Posted: 11 June 2011 at 7:21pm
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There are many people in my state who cannot understand or speak Hindi, yes Hyderabad is an exception, in fact I think Hyderabad also has the most number of Urdu speaking people as well, my grand father was a renowned Urdu poet who has received awards even from the president of India (back in the 90's). Most people in south India are not very good in Hindi, but if you go north you cannot survive without Hindi. Mumbai is a beautiful place where in you'll find people speaking all types of languages. ------------- God is a better planner... so whenever u'r plan fails, cheer up... God has a better plan for you! |
Posted By: zuhair_abbasi
Date Posted: 13 June 2011 at 8:15am
| That's cool Sam - what was his name - I am a huge poetry fan |
Posted By: vote4peace
Date Posted: 13 June 2011 at 2:51pm
Yane vishesha kiranki. I'd worked in Bangalore for close to two years after my Engineering, picked up on a little bit of kannada, very little though. People told me that most words similar in all four Dravidian languages. True that but I still found it a little tough to cope initially. Guess Kannada more liken to Telugu and Tamil to Malayalam. And very true most people down south do not converse all that well in Hindi. Bangalore and Hyderbad being the exceptions. Least spoken in Kerala and Tamil Nadu. ------------- I distrust a camel.. and anyone else who can go a week without a drink.
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Posted By: kirankri
Date Posted: 14 June 2011 at 6:29am
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Good try V4P. It should be Enu Vishesha Kiran? meaning "What's special Kiran?".
Enu Vishesha illla V4P .
Do you visit Bengaluru anytime? If so, call me when you are here next time. May be, meet over a cup of coffee would be great.
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Posted By: zuhair_abbasi
Date Posted: 14 June 2011 at 7:16am
| Any of you fellows live in Delhi? I will be in Delhi at the end of this month - would be great to meet a CW memeber |
Posted By: Mikey
Date Posted: 14 June 2011 at 10:25am
| If any of you guys ever hit up Perth, then chuck us a personal message and the beer/coffee is on me~! |
Posted By: spin wizard
Date Posted: 14 June 2011 at 1:53pm
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If any of you guys ever come to St. Vincent and the Grenadines, i'll just recommend where to visit. No beers would be on me. Putting that offer to someone like Sledger might just send me broke!! ------------- In troubled times, being philosophical helps a great deal, it helps you to remain sane and not do any further damage. |
Posted By: zuhair_abbasi
Date Posted: 14 June 2011 at 2:29pm
| As the general rule of ethics - I have heard a visitor should not take more than two pegs. So you can offer Sledge too Spinny |
Posted By: sam_ahmed
Date Posted: 14 June 2011 at 6:27pm
You can google Ali Ahmed Jaleeli / Dr. Ali Ahmed Jaleeli, I'm sure you'll find many results zuhair.
------------- God is a better planner... so whenever u'r plan fails, cheer up... God has a better plan for you! |
Posted By: sam_ahmed
Date Posted: 14 June 2011 at 6:40pm
oh! My wife will also be in Delhi at the end of this month and she actually wanted me to come but unfortunately I'm not able to go because of my hectic work schedule otherwise I could have come Zuhair! ------------- God is a better planner... so whenever u'r plan fails, cheer up... God has a better plan for you! |
Posted By: spin wizard
Date Posted: 17 June 2011 at 2:12am
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Who would have thought that a Pakistani and Indian would be glad to meet up? Sam maybe Indian by blood but he is Pakistani by heart! ------------- In troubled times, being philosophical helps a great deal, it helps you to remain sane and not do any further damage. |
Posted By: zuhair_abbasi
Date Posted: 17 June 2011 at 7:43am
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It has mostly been a pleasure meeting Indians - you are generally welcome there. And it is not only about Sam, i would have been as glad to meet any of the Indian members be it Kiran. Dips or Raj. Rather, Raj is one guy whom I want to meet more badly. Needless to say, anyone of you guys ever plan to visit any part of Pakistan - I am just a message away - you will be taken good care of. Although, I know that is not going to happen anytime soon :(
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Posted By: kirankri
Date Posted: 17 June 2011 at 2:51pm
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It would be my pleasure too to meet you Zuhair. Let me know when you have plans to visit Bangalore. And thanks for the invitation to visit you.
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Posted By: sam_ahmed
Date Posted: 17 June 2011 at 5:24pm
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Wrong Spinny, I know a very famous Indian Tennis star from my home town and a very famous Pakistani cricketer who are not just glad to meet each other but are happily married to each other! well I don't think normal indians and pakistanis have anything against each other, in fact my friend who is in US since last 4-5 years tells me that in the US, the Indians, the Pakistanis and the Bangladeshis actually feel very happy to be in each others company and they refer to each other as "Desi" rather than by nationality. My relative who is in US since a very long time now married a Pakistani boy just a couple of years ago and I don't know what is the nationality of their baby, Indian or Pakistani? ------------- God is a better planner... so whenever u'r plan fails, cheer up... God has a better plan for you! |
Posted By: zuhair_abbasi
Date Posted: 18 June 2011 at 8:38am
| American |
Posted By: Mikey
Date Posted: 18 June 2011 at 9:02am
| A citizen of "British India"? |
Posted By: sam_ahmed
Date Posted: 18 June 2011 at 10:50am
 well I doubt if they have any plans of returning permanently to India or Pakistan, so the baby might well be an American! ------------- God is a better planner... so whenever u'r plan fails, cheer up... God has a better plan for you! |
Posted By: spin wizard
Date Posted: 18 June 2011 at 3:36pm
Probably the truest thing you have ever said on this forum bhai. ------------- In troubled times, being philosophical helps a great deal, it helps you to remain sane and not do any further damage. |
Posted By: spin wizard
Date Posted: 18 June 2011 at 3:37pm
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I think the rules have changed in regards to citizenship of babies born in America from foreign nationals. If they at the time wasn't a citizen of America, then it would take the nationality of the mother. Can't fully remember but there were some changes to these stuff not too long ago. ------------- In troubled times, being philosophical helps a great deal, it helps you to remain sane and not do any further damage. |
Posted By: vote4peace
Date Posted: 20 June 2011 at 2:26pm
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Wow lots of invitations being thrown around I see . Not one to be left far behind I too would like to cordially invite anyone willing to come to Kochi or somewhere close by. And Kiranki thanks for the gesture. I would surely let you know incase I come to Bangalore which could very well happen sooner than later bokha vishesha
------------- I distrust a camel.. and anyone else who can go a week without a drink.
|
Posted By: spin wizard
Date Posted: 24 August 2011 at 8:18pm
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Sam, aap kay pas kitnii cricket balla hai?
aap ka cricket bat konsa pasandeeda hai Zuhair bhai? ------------- In troubled times, being philosophical helps a great deal, it helps you to remain sane and not do any further damage. |